Using Kickstarter to Validate Your New Product Idea with Antonia Saint Dunbar

Co-Founder/Owner of THINX, Icon, Antonia Saint NY, The Brooklyn Shoe Factory – Antonia Saint Dunbar

I’m excited to have the amazing Antonia Saint Dunbar on the show. In this episode, Antonia talks about how she started in entrepreneurship and how she jumped into an industry with a patriarchal system and has almost no innovation.

Antonia is the Co-Founder and Owner of THINX, Icon, The Brooklyn Shoe Factory, and Antonia Saint NY.
Antonia led the design of THINX and was the Chief of Operations for years, and she is now taking on the shoe industry with her new high-tech heels and flats that feel like sneakers on the inside where she raised $1.8 M in 40 days with pre-orders from 7,000 people around the world.

Learnings for this episode:

• How to dive into a new startup idea (and make it huge)
• How to jumpstart your business into an industry that has almost no innovation
• How to present your idea into the world – what works and what doesn’t
• How doing the one thing that you’ve been putting off can help move forward to your goal of a million

Antonia’s Websites:

SheTHINX.com
AntoniaSaintNY.com
IconUndies.com

Transcript: Download

Video Transcription provided by GMR Transcription Services.

Jaime Masters: 	Welcome to Eventual Millionaire. I am Jaime Masters and I?ve been already laughing so hard. I have Antonia Saint Dunbar on the show. Now, she runs THINX, Icon, a brand-new business that did $1.8 million ? which is insane ? on Kickstarter in 40 days, called The Brooklyn Shoe Factory. Thanks so much for coming on the show today.

Antonia Saint Dunbar:	Thank you so much, Jaime. Thanks for having me. 

Jaime:	You do an insane amount ? and it?s all about women and the issues that women have, along with new trends and technology, which I?m really excited about. But THINX started in 2014 and you?ve started a whole bunch of companies since. How did you even get into entrepreneurship? Was it THINX?

Antonia:	Entrepreneurship definitely did begin with THINX, yes, actually. And I got to correct the timeline because time flies so fast. The idea actually formulated between Radha and Miki Agrawal way back, I think maybe 2006. Miki had shared the idea with me in 2010. We founded the LLC in 2011. Worked, worked, worked in a silo like planning, knowing this idea was going to be huge, and then bringing it out to the market with a Kickstarter campaign actually. I think that was 2013. And then in 2014, we had the bigger launch the world got to know about. But it was years of hard work. 

	That?s the thing that entrepreneurs don?t really know about or see is that there?s so much that goes on behind the scenes before the world gets to start to pay attention. Then to fast forward to now, it was while I was walking to the headquarters of THINX that I had an idea for a high-tech shoe. My feet were killing me. That is what I?m focused on right now. The name of that company actually is Antonia Saint New York, a play on my grandmother?s name and then also my name, my first and middle name. Because designers oftentimes use their name. So, that?s my now focus. But yeah, it?s been quite a journey.

Jaime:	Okay. I want to totally get into the shoe thing because man, I have feet issues. But what?s interesting is ?

Antonia:	So many of us do.

Jaime:	? when we?re looking up ? like, I found it on Wikipedia, right? I think you have a really huge point to make that the world is like, ?Oh, she?s only been in this for a few years. Look how amazing this is.? And how fast the growth was. What did ? and you can relate it to the new shoe company, too, but what were those years of figuring out all this stuff out? What did you actually do from 2011 to 2013?

Antonia:	I know, right? It was, at the time I was focused on advertising and public relations at ? there was no one person out of us three co-founders that was focused on full-time. Miki had her restaurants. Radha had her puppet company. I was working at a recording studio playing my cello. I was raised to be a classical cellist. But yeah, when we shared the seed of the idea, which was a stain-resistant underwear and with a give-back back in 2010, a seed was planted. It just made us all know. I had this hunger. I was so deeply unsatisfied with the work that I was doing at the time. 

	I wanted to make a difference in the world. I just wasn?t finding I was doing that on a day-to-day basis. I just decided to take the leap. It was June 2012 and my husband said, ?You know what? If you believe in it, let?s do it. I will support you in this.? For nine months, we worked on product development, worked on finalizing the prototype. I found a production partner. We did probably 20 rounds of prototypes just to get the fit, the technology, everything right to bring to market. Then we had to launch. We brought it to Kickstarter. Launched and it took another nine months to finalized everything and get production ready and then we delivered product. 

Jaime:	So, did you know, and this is the thing, right? Because you?re jumping into an industry that has almost no innovation forever, right?

Antonia:	Yeah, no innovation. 

Jaime:	And you guys are three people that didn?t have a ton of experience in this industry beforehand. How the heck do you do that? You just keeping going with the punches? Everybody wants to hear how you dealt with the craziness and the learning curve. 

Antonia:	Well, necessity is the mother of every invention. So, we all had this problem of let?s just share and break the taboo and say leaking and staining in our underwear during our monthly period. So, we?re like, there is no underwear that?s widely available that will address this. Yet it is a problem that when we talk to our girlfriends, we talk to anybody that has this issue of a monthly period, which we all do, they were having this problem but no one was talking about it. You can go to a department store and there?s no functionality. There?s also no durability. Underwear would fall apart. They?d be these beautiful, lacy, frilly things. 

	They wouldn?t last. So, we just knew that we wanted to make this. That it was a problem that we had. Therefore, finding that others had the same problem. We could do something about that. I don?t know what it was. I look back now and I attribute it to my father. He was the Chief of Design at General Motors. He ended up working there for 30 years. He led the teams doing the car logos. He also, when General Motors owned Frigidaire for some 60 years, he developed a whole line for that company that in my childhood, I actually used a stove and refrigerator that my father had designed. 

	He would always point out to me in the world, do you see how you can?t even read that sign? Like how horribly designed that is? Or you see how that building, the columns don?t really support the structure? It looks awful. He would just point out things as we would drive in the car. I started to learn design can either be functional and lead to an increased enjoyment or ability in your life or it can hold you back. The same thing I found with underwear. That?s why I just really, when I led the design of the product, I really was like, how can this be better? Now, same with the shoes. How can this be better? 

	In both industries, it?s a patriarchal system where these men have designed these things that really have no function for us and they kind of suck. 

Jaime:	It?s like a David and Goliath though, too. That?s the thing that is so impressive is that not only did you go, oh, this is a problem. Because everybody knows heels are a problem. Every female knows that?s a problem, but no ? I shouldn?t say no ? but barely any people are going, let me fix it. Not even the big shoe companies. It?s a huge industry. Don?t get me wrong. How do you are the little, tiny, David and Goliath, how do you actually face that stuff? Because that?s huge. 

Antonia:	Yeah, it is huge. I will say that a team is so important. Having my two co-founders, they really gave me the confidence to also quit my job and focus on it full-time. I saw both of them thriving in their own businesses. They?re definite spit-fires, both of them. I just felt buoyed by that support. It really is a story of three women coming together and making something, making this dream possible. When we launched on Kickstarter, finding the community, finding the people that were actually resonating with the idea, people started to talk about it. 

	It attracted some very, very influential strategic partners, people that wanted to invest in our business. One we got very far with almost bringing them on as a partner before realizing the deal wasn?t right. And then we attracted an incredible strategic partner for us who is one of the No. 1, I think they are No. 1 suppliers for Nike. They do a lot of Lululemon, a lot of really great other brands. It?s a testament to us finding something. I like to say the riches are in the niches because we identified a problem that no one was really addressing because it was such a taboo. 

	No one really wanted to talk about it and talk about it in a fun, engaging, informative way where people could talk about it. If you look at the French-Polynesian word that is the root of ?taboo,? it?s actually tapua, and it means menstruation. 

Jaime:	What? I didn?t even know that.

Antonia:	Yes.

Jaime:	That?s hilarious.

Antonia:	So, it?s literally a taboo, even just dealing with a monthly cycle. So, we wanted to break that down and by doing it, we found our audience. We have millions of customers all around the world that love the product and share it with their friends. Women are great about sharing solutions with each other. Yeah. So, just believing in it and knowing that this a problem that we face. We?ve got to bring it out into the world. Because if we believe in it and need it, other people do too.

Jaime:	I saw it on Facebook. One of my friends posted. I?m like, why is one of my friends posting about that? Like, it?s weird. Right? 

Antonia:	Yeah.

Jaime:	Even for me, it?s weird. Because it?s taboo, right? And then I bought some and I?m like, huh, this is amazing. So, but is it just the idea? Like even when you think about the shoe company, so when we know there?s a bazillion different ?solutions? for heels. And I?ve had foot surgery and I have an extra bone in my foot. Most people don?t realize that. I had one of them taken out and the other one ? so I can?t really wear heels. I used to and I can?t. I have tons of them and I can never wear any of them. And so everybody knows that the issue is there and women and shoes, right?

Antonia:	Mm-hmm. But they?re gorgeous, right? The right shoe is gorgeous and it changes the outfit, changes the way you walk, everything.

Jaime:	I agree. A million times over. So, you?re like oh, problem. There should be a solution by now. How do you dive into the market for that? Because I feel like with the underwear that you had before, at least that was so taboo that it created a stir, right? Whereas, you?re like shoes are a problem. It?s like, yeah, they are. We know they are. Okay, great. What is your thing? What do we got? How did you get $1.8 million on Kickstarter?

Antonia:	Yes, in 45 days on Kickstarter. We were like the 120th most funded campaign in history on Kickstarter. Which was incredibly validating for the idea. We identified the pain points and told the story in a compelling, again, engaging way that women and men who love the shoe could relate to. What I did was I created the design based on the problems that I had and then found two shoemakers here in New York to actually bring the ideas to life and then also consulting with a leading podiatric surgeon to be like, you know what? These three other things are some of the main problems that women face; let?s add those, too. 

	And so I focused on three things. The three things were, the three Cs I like to call it. Women, we have the diamonds on our fingers. Carat, color, cut and all of those. And then with the shoe, I was like why is it that this is on our feet, our very foundation that we move through life with, and yet it doesn?t get the same weight of importance as something that?s just sparkling on our finger. And so I call it the three Cs, which is comfort, construction, and then also customizing the fit. So, I tackled those three things. With comfort, that?s key. That?s so key. You have these high heels, even flats. 

	There?s no technology in these shoes that support you while you walk. We are walking on harder surfaces than we?ve ever walked as a population on this planet and yet the only thing that gives us a bounce back is a sneaker, which we should only be really wearing when we?re running or when we?re working out. We don?t necessarily want to wear that with our beautiful clothes to a meeting or to a night out on the town, but yet that?s what we feel the best in. So, I basically took technology, took design from the sneaker world and built it into the shoe. Of our taglines is it looks classic on the outside, but it feels like a sneaker on the inside. 

	Oftentimes, one wears a flatter heel with a bare foot. Nothing else on it. No sock. So, I built in comfort strips around the heel. Comfort strips around the tops of the toes. Women have longer toes. When you get a bump, you get a corn, you get callouses. Women have bunions. 60% of us have bunions. That hits the inside of a very hard shoe. Why does the inside of that shoe need to be hard? So, I built ? I call it the soft surround system. Surrounding the whole entire foot. The insert that I worked tirelessly on and consulted with a podiatric surgeon, you have two and a half times your body weight coming down on the ball of your foot when you walk in a high heel. 

	So as a 120-pound woman, that?s 350 pounds. Oh, my goodness. Of course your feet are going to kill, even in 20 minutes of wearing it. So I built up that area underneath the ball of the foot to give you an additional bounce back. A heel cup to hold you in the heel, help you walk. So, all of these different things ? comfort. Then when it comes to fit, 88% of women wear shoes that are the wrong size for their feet. It?s crazy. We don?t even know our size. Because think about it, when is the last time that you?ve even fit your feet? Like when is the last time you measured your feet? Probably in a long time. 

Jaime:	When I had two for my children, so I did the little thing in the shoe thing, yeah.

Antonia:	Yeah, sure. Like to show the kids how to do it. Like I remember those Brannock devices in the shoe store when I was going and getting my shoes as a kid. I stopped measuring my feet when I was maybe 18 years old. I thought I was that same size for the rest of my life. You?re not. Women who go through pregnancy, weight changes, our feet change. They actually do grow bigger. We wear stretchy sandals and summer shoes. Our feet stretch out. Our sizes change. Also 60% of us have two different sized feet. So, at our company, we have actually the ability to mix and match your sizes. No other company does that. 

	It?s complicated, sure, on the fulfillment level, but you can do it. We have a split shoe box. It?s incredibly powerful. Because then you can have a shoe that you don?t wear with a sock or anything else, just fit your feet perfectly. That?s the other thing. And also construction. That?s the last one. The last C. Which is I found that I would buy an $800.00 pair of shoes, they would fall apart. The heel tip would pop off. It would get scuffed. It would look horrible at my second event that I would wear them to. In New York, especially, you?ve got these grates, these city grates. You step in one, the whole heel gets shredded. 

	I?m like, this is ridiculous. So we have literally ballistic nylon, bulletproof material around the back of the heel. We have built up the heel tips. We have heel tips that last two and a half times longer. Like, we really were thoughtful in the design. Again, this is just creating the most ideal product. Looking at it and being like, what could I do? And finding the right production partners to bring it to life and just believing in it. Like, I want these shoes so bad. That?s why I, you know, have the late nights and the harrowing moments of oh, my God, is this going to work? 

	And you just get through it, you know? Because you?re dedicated to it. You have to be super, super passionate as an entrepreneur. It?s tough work to bring something new to life.

Jaime:	Well, that?s where, okay, so, I want to unpack all of that because that?s so much. And what you were talking about ? and it?s really interesting because you can hear all the features coming through because you are the product designer also. And you can be like, then there?s this and then there?s this. We?re told as entrepreneurs, features versus benefits. And I watched your video and your video does an amazing at explaining the tech, but why it?s so important. So that way, the woman goes, ?I do want that.? 

	Not only like, because no offense, everybody?s like, I have the best shoe. It?s more comfortable. It?s whatever. Then you buy it and you?re like, ?This sucks.? Right? So, how do you get that message across to everyone? Especially you being so close to the product? 

Antonia:	Infographics, I find in the realm of people not actually reading much.

Jaime:	Seriously, nobody does. Yeah. 

Antonia:	You really have to bring it right into their face. So, we did create a video that?s short. That you can see the technology come to life with CG animation. Way before the product even was absolute, fully finalized. We had to digitalize and represent it. Then speaking to the benefits after every piece of the solution. So, for instance, with the underwear, it was like, this is moisture-wicking. And we explained why that?s important. With the shoe, it?s like, ?This strip helps prevent blisters.? So, people really got the point. People go by so fast with choosing to use a product and you have to explain it quickly and digestibly for them to understand it and visuals really do help. 

Jaime:	Yeah. Everybody should check out the video too because it was, so don?t get my wrong, like I was like, I?ve given up on heels. So, no offense, but I was like, nah, I?ll watch your video. Hopefully, it means something but literally, extra weirdo bones, right, lady. I?m not normal. So, I?m watching it though and the way that you guys do it in the, this is the feature for this. It does this. This now lasts two times longer. This does this. So, as entrepreneurs, when we?re trying to flesh out what that is, the features versus benefits, because no offense, not a lot of owners are very good at the marketing side. I feel like you guys did a really good job of showing this is the tech. This is why it?s better. 

Antonia:	Thank you.

Jaime:	But this is why you should care that it?s better, right?

Antonia:	Yes.

Jaime:	Did you do that all yourself or do you have, was it part of your team? What?s your piece in it?

Antonia:	I did, actually, own that process for this round and I just found that through storytelling ? a story is really what?s going to get your idea seen and remembered and therefore shared to others. You have to have it be easily replicable in the storytelling. And so, that was something that I learned very much from working and co-founding THINX. I knew how important that Kickstarter video was going to be and bringing that story out. 

	And amazingly, it resonated with people around the world in multiple different cultures. It?s loved already on, I would say, every continent already. So, storytelling really is a key piece that unlocks the idea and adopts ?

[Crosstalk] 

Jaime:	Give us some tips on that too because the thing is, ideas are a dime a dozen. That?s what everyone talks about. I feel like it?s the translation process that people aren?t very good at. To go from, I have it, it?s amazing and it is technically better. For anybody else to share it though, they have to think it?s better also. So, that?s translation sometimes gets lost. Give us some tips that you have on doing better storytelling and those ideas.

Antonia:	Oh, wow. I mean, it?s like coming up with that one tagline, ?it looks classic on the outside, feels like a sneaker on the inside.? Boom, people know what it is. There?s no real explanation even needed after that point. That will get you eyeballs and then you can tell more about what the product does. You have to find ?

Jaime:	How did you come up with that though? Like, how did you even get there?

Antonia:	It?s like taking out a piece of paper and writing. What are the key benefits? Brainstorming what are the key things. When I think back to actually thinking of the name for THINX. We?re like, well, it?s thoughtful underwear. It thinks of you when you?re not even thinking, right? It should perform without you even needing to. You just put it on and you don?t have to do anything. Also, we add the give-back, right? In the beginning, it was one pair of underwear sold, fund seven pads for a girl in the developing world for her monthly cycle. So, it was thoughtful underwear, really, all around. 

	When it came to the shoe company, it was like thinking about how products had failed us when it came to a flat and a heel and how to just quickly tell how this one is different. Another tagline we have is ?you can?t break a glass ceiling with a glass slipper.? The idea of a hard, painful shoe. We are working women. We?re out there in the world trying to be present in our meetings, trying to go to an event and enjoy ourselves or talk to that person that we?re nervous to talk to but want to make a good impression with. 

	If we have even 20% of our brain focused on the pain that we feel in our feet, we?re not going to be our best selves. We?re not going to be centered. So, I don?t know. Really, for me, I?m a very visual person. I come from an artistic family. I find that you have to get away from the computer and take a piece of paper out and just start writing. I think back to coming up with a name for THINX. Originally, the girls had come up, finalized on the name Celebration. I was like, oh, my God, we can never call it that. We realized that would, could never call it [inaudible] [00:20:31] period. 

	But I had pages, I had like three pages of what other ideas could it be and it?s a process. You have to go through so many wrong things before you find the right thing that will really distill it and bring your idea front and center where people will understand it. 

Jaime:	How do you know it?s right then though, right? Because there?s no guy going, good job, guys. Ladies.

Antonia:	I think you have to work on your intuition and that?s guided me a lot in the world. Also, when you do something like a Kickstarter campaign, you start to learn from presenting your idea out into the world what works and what doesn?t. For instance, we learned an early lesson in 2013 with THINX on Kickstarter that we had our nude called nude. That was a rookie mistake. But before the nude conversation had really happened. We changed that to beige pretty darn quickly because there are many different shades of nude in the world. But we learned that through getting feedback from others. 

	So, also, getting feedback, sharing with your friends and community, sharing on a platform like Kickstarter. It?s a great place to survey your people. And if something isn?t working, you?re going to pretty much find out very quickly from them by getting feedback.

Jaime:	Like, shoot, oh, shoot, change that. Okay, great. Trial by fire. 

Antonia:	Yes, totally.

Jaime:	Which, again, is a testament to you guys listening and then actually making those changes, which is wonderful. But Kickstarter is a whole beast in itself.

Antonia:	Oh, my God, it?s a beast.

Jaime:	And you?re doing it again. So, given me some tips on Kickstarter too. Because I know a lot of people that are ? especially with a big idea like these that take quite a bit of funding and you want to validate it at the same time. Give us some why you chose it and who should be picking it.

Antonia:	Yes. So, very different, by the way, creating underwear and creating shoes. Creating underwear, you?re dealing with a pattern, you?re dealing with fabric. Yes, we have technology. Great, advanced technology in that underwear for THINX. But it?s very different than creating a shoe, which is literally like a car for your feet. Especially when you?re doing a high-tech shoe like ours. So, it?s very capital intensive and Kickstarter was a great place to go for that original seed funding because yeah, it?s incredibly expensive to do. But some of the challenges for Kickstarter is you have to be prepared that if your idea does have major success, like ours did, I was nostalgic. 

	I set a $50,000 goal like I did for THINX for the shoe company and we hit that within 24 hours. I was like, uh-oh, here we go. We attracted more than 8,000 people pretty darn quickly. To take care of those people, you have to plan for because customer service is going to be your No. 1 issue after you raise that money. People are going to want their product. They?re going to be excited about your product. They?re going to want to deliver it to them and meet your timeline. 

	The problem, and I want to see Kickstarter evolve a bit because Kickstarter as a company I feel could do even more supporting the creators because we?re living in a world where you have these people that don?t understand, we do not have a company already established. This is the first time we?re creating this together, with you, with your funding. That is a message you have to help them understand as you go forward. So, communication is key. Communication is so key. Updating your backers. Keeping them on a low simmer. Because if they get on a high burn on the stove waiting for your product, they will start eating you alive. 

Jaime:	They get mad, yeah. I paid for this, right? Come on, give it to me now. 

Antonia:	Yes. Understandably. They?re excited. They want the solution, which is great. But man, yeah, you have to be able to communicate. You?ve got to have the customer support. So, we?ve had a couple growing pains at the shoe company for sure. In the beginning, we had two customer service people and that just was not enough for 80,000 people. It ended up being many more because we had web sales happening. So, we had to increase that staff. There?s time to train them. So, there are a lot of complications that go on. Being as prepared as you can be in the beginning is helpful. 

	Also, get your prototype to as finished of a place as you possibly can. It?s challenging though. Because I understand you want to put it on Kickstarter because you need to get to the money to get to your final prototype. But whatever you can do with friends and family support, keeping it close to the chest and then bring it out into the world. It will help. Because people also really don?t want to wait too long. They really don?t want to wait ? they want to wait about the time it takes to make a baby. About nine months. At most. There?s something about nine months. I?m not kidding. 

	It?s just that?s where the stamina runs out for people. Do the testing that you can with the people that you have, friends and family, again, with your prototype. Because working out the kinks in advance and not having it shared like on the public stage is the least painful process. It will be the least painful for you. Also, think about shipping internationally. People don?t realize you?re putting your idea out there. You?re going to get people from Australia, from Singapore. How are you going to ship it to them? Are you going to pay for duties? Are you going to pay for the VAT? 

	We had actually one country ? they won?t be named, named anonymously ? who literally held a pair of shoes and would not let it out to their customer unless we paid some exorbitant fee. Like basically the cost of the shoes themselves. And so you?ve got to really understand, are you going to be able to deal with all that or should you focus on the U.S.? Really only ship to the U.S. in the beginning if you?re going to do that. Scale closer. Positives from Kickstarter? You ability find your market. You find your market. 

	You?re able to survey your people really well. Find out what works about the product, what you should change, your terminology what you should change before you then make bold billboards with this stuff. And then testing price point is also really helpful. Then also honing in on your storytelling and focusing on how you want this to be shared widely with the world. Just getting really, really focused on that. So, you?ll get funding. You will get the funding. That?s important. But there are so many other things about it you?ve got to be prepared for. 

Jaime:	How did you do all of that and ? do you still work at THINX and Icon and how did you, because that?s a lot.

Antonia:	No. We have a great CEO at THINX and a great CEO at Icon and a team of, my god, I think we?re approaching 80-some people this year. So, that is its own operating, amazing system. I?m still one of the largest shareholders, active with the Board. But they are a powerful, impassioned team that believes in the vision of that company and they?re at it day in and day out. Around 2015 is when I started the seed of the idea for the shoe company. I am now full-time focused on it. Ever since I launched the Kickstarter. Shortly before that. And I?m also a mom of two daughters. 

	So, it?s definitely a lot to balance. I have an amazing husband and I am able to have help, which is great. It?s not the easiest thing, for sure, being an entrepreneur and a mother. But time management, man. 

Jaime:	I feel like moms of kids that are entrepreneurs are the best time management people ever. I have another interview with the one thing, Jay Papasan, who wrote that book. I?m like, and, that?s great, and kids, and, and, but there?s more than one thing. I don?t know. So, how do you balance? Well, ?balance?? How do you manage all of those things?

Antonia:	It?s really, really hard. It?s really hard. And I think we need to talk more about just how hard it is so that things can change, to be honest. I find that we are still very much living in a patriarchal society that does not recognize motherhood and how important that is and how important those early years are to be there with your child. To be able to nurse my daughter and to have that connection, that bond. I have a two and a half year old now and we are so close because I was able to have time to do that, but not many mothers are supported in that way. You have two weeks, I mean, in some companies. 

	There are some mothers that they have a job that?s minimum wage and they have to go to work. They can?t pump. It?s just so many challenges that mothers face. I?m glad that New York has a great policy now that just went into effect this year. My God, it?s 2018. It?s taken forever just to get three months of support for mothers on maternity leave. But there?s so much more that we have to do. I think U.K. is a great example for us. They have like a year of maternity leave for mothers. It?s partial pay at some point from their job and they can?t get fired. We need to have that kind of support for mothers. 

	So, when you?re an entrepreneur, you?re able to be more flexible because it is your schedule, you set it more so. But your kids set your schedule, too. Like, they demand attention. You can?t get an email done in the same room as a child, okay? People need to understand how hard it is. But if you raise good children, my God, it changes the world. So, I want us to be able to focus on them more and I really hope policies start to change where we can be more empowered to be mothers and [inaudible] [00:30:33] than ever before at a record pace in America and I want that to be more supportive. Women have great ideas. But we also bear the children. Hello! 

Jaime:	Oh, yeah. My daughter?s nine now, my youngest. And I was working for myself and I was a solo-preneur and I was a coach and that?s all I did. I remember nursing and having the laptop at 2:00 in the morning going, I just gotta get this one thing and she?s okay, so we?re good. Like, you just gotta do what you gotta do. 

Antonia:	Yeah. How many kids do you have now?

Jaime:	I have two.

Antonia:	Congratulations. 

Jaime:	Yeah, right? They?re still alive. Okay, we?re good. We?re still good. Whew. 

Antonia:	They?re still alive! Exactly. It?s all about keeping them alive. 

Jaime:	Goal No. 1, right? That?s sometimes how it feels when you?re a mom. Going like, I want to be the perfect mother as best I can and gosh darn it, kids, come on. It?s hard work. Give us a break for a minute. It is one of those things where they don?t see, but they see what you do to manage it. I?m a single mom of two kids, right? So, I?m like, I?ve got all the things. Thankfully, I don?t work a minimum wage job because I can only imagine what that would be like for people. Well, for a mom, a single mom. But to be able to go through and go okay, this is my priority No. 1 are my kids. No. 2, business. 

	It?s hard to be able to go, okay, well, they need this and you don?t realize until after-effects. On if you screw up your kids or if you screw up your business, usually it takes a little while. So, we?re just doing the best we can with what we have and hoping that it all turns out okay, right?

Antonia:	Yes. I find that children teach you about living in the present moment because literally in the blink of an eye, they could hurt themselves. So, they teach you that. And one thing that?s so important is that if you are going to be a mother and an entrepreneur, you have to put down the device. You have to be present with them in the moments that you are able to spend time with that and make that time really rich. I recommend making dates with your kids. Victoria and I, my oldest, who?s two and a half, we now do mommy and toddler yoga on Fridays, which is, by the way, really great for anxiety control. 

	And she has a newborn in the house that?s taking Mama?s additional attention. So, make time for them so that you can be fully the mom or the dad, whoever? listening to this, that you want to be. Because that time really makes a difference. If you have them in a daycare or with a nanny or whoever else is managing the care throughout the day, bring on great people. You really want to find people that resonate with you, that really have the same kind of values as you because they?re going to be spending a lot of time with these other people, with these other caregivers. 

	So, work on that as well. If you have family, that?s great. Not everyone lives close to their family. We have such a nuclear family that lives now in [inaudible] [00:33:34] all around the world. We?re all spread out. But really being present is so important. And then be present to your entrepreneurial goals. There?s time. You have to make buckets for it all with your time and focus.

Jaime:	Is that what you do? Because that?s the other piece. Is that I always feel like mom has mommy guilt no matter where you go, right? So, when you?re guilty you?re not working on your business and when you?re with your business, you?re guilty you?re not with your children. So, you?re never happy, which is a wonderful thing, right? How do you flip that? 

Antonia:	I know. I will say, for me, one thing that really, really helps too, that grounds me as an entrepreneur and as a person is having a morning meditation practice. My meditation is my medication. Just setting the day right. It is the foundation. Just doing that, everything else is more manageable. So, whatever guilt I?m feeling for not being 100% perfect, I?m like, you know what? There?s self-love there too. Like, I?m going to be able to say okay, you?re doing the best that you can. This is a challenging situation. Thank God for support. And you also go back into gratitude. 

	To be able to see the light and see the things that are going well. When I don?t do my meditation, then you skew negative. You skew to all the problems, right? So, I really find that?s such a key. Because it?s not an easy journey. It?s really not. It is such an easy way to say how does she balance it? How does she do it all? Actually, you don?t do it all. You do what you can every day. You do what you can. And if you make progress in your entrepreneurial vision by writing those three important emails that one day, that?s a successful day sometimes. It just has to come down to that. 

	You cannot set the bar so high that it?s unattainable and then you beat yourself up. 

Jaime:	That?s when you spiral. I?m so thankful that you said morning meditation because my children know when I have not meditated for the day. I mostly meditate every day, but sometimes you?re like, so, Mom? I?m like, yeah. 

Antonia:	Are you okay, Mom?

Jaime:	Totally missed it. Yeah, I noticed too. Thanks. But imagine how amazing that is, teaching your kids that when Mommy doesn?t meditate, she goes a little crazier, right? Comparatively. It?s actually teaching them to have a good meditation practice at this early age too, which I wish I had. We?re raising the kids we wish you would've been when you were little.

Antonia:	And for them at this age, it?s like nap time. Their meditation is like nap time or quiet time. Just quieting the mind. I?m teaching Victoria, like quiet the mind. Listen to your breath. Calm down. Be peaceful. Feel relaxed. It?s definitely a process. Especially living in a city like New York. There?s so much stimuli everywhere. You have to learn how to disconnect. And with our devices, my God. I was not raised with them. I?m grateful that at the foot my stairs growing up there was an Encyclopedia Britannica that I would open and not find the answers that I was looking for and get so frustrated. 

	So, I have a deep appreciation for the worldwide web now. These millennials do not have that appreciation. But with all that greatness of these devices, it can suck your energy and make you a frenzied person. The brain is an electric thing. It needs time to unplug. And so we have to provide that to ourselves. 

Jaime:	I adore that. 

Antonia:	And then we can do what we need to do. 

Jaime:	Yeah, as everyone?s listening to a podcast right now, going oh, I?m plugged in right at this moment. They?re in my ears. 

Antonia:	Well, maybe they?re running. Maybe they?re cooking, right?

Jaime:	Right? We?re not actually ? that?s why podcasts are amazing. So, I know I need to wrap up, but I adore the chat about yes, growth is amazing and so is joy, right? On the daily life. So, I?m going to wrap up with a last question. What is one action listeners can take this week to help them move forward towards their goal of a million?

Antonia:	One action. Well, they would know. Go deep within themselves. Sit and go deep within and ask themselves, what is that one thing that I have just been putting off and that I know that if I did it, it would really make a difference? You have to follow that little seed because those seeds come into your intuition, into your mind. You know that?s scary and it freaks you out and maybe you?re totally nervous and that?s why you?ve not done it. Just do it. Just literally do it. My Mom has this saying, she says, ?Even if your toes have to get scrunched up in your shoes, do it anyway and say it anyway.? Like, you just have to do it. You have to.

Jaime:	I love that your mother has a quote about shoes also. 

Antonia:	That?s true. I never thought about it that way. 

Jaime:	But now, with the new shoe technology, they don?t have to get scrunched. Tell us where we can find more about the shoes, where we can get them, more about THINX, and more about you.

Antonia:	Yeah. So, THINX is at www.shethinx.com. S-H-E thinx.com. T-H-I-N-X, by the way. And then Icon is also iconundies, U-N-D-I-E-S. Icon is an empowering spin on the word incontinence because that product is all about helping you when you pee and sneeze and pee a little. And then the shoe company is AntoniaSaintNY, for New York, .com. And it?s S-A-I-N-T.com. And you can find me on Instagram. Antonia Saint Dunbar. That?s where I live and post frequently. 

Jaime:	I love it. We?re gonna link everything up and now I?m gonna go follow you on Instagram. So, everyone else do that too. Thank you so much for coming on today. I really, really appreciate it. 

Antonia:	Thank you, Jaime. This has been great. So great to connect.

Tags: Antonia Saint Dunbar, Business Owner, entrepreneur podcast, eventual millionaire, how to get started in entrepreneurship, how to start a kickstarter, jaime masters, millionaire entrepreneurs, podcast, start-ups / startups, startup entrepreneur, top entrepreneurs

Categories: All, Featured Millionaire Interview, Millionaire Interviews

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